“I want people to understand that I recognize their humanity”  

A Dialogue on Trauma and Care 

Brandon Brown, 
Philadelphia Healthy and Safe Schools Initiative 

 

Abstract: I sat down with Brandon Brown, Trauma Specialist, after school hours one day this month.  Brandon Brown is a Certified Trauma Practitioner and is also an Instructor with Lakeside Global. Mr. Brown is a native of West Philadelphia, has been grounded in trauma conversation for nearly a decade. He is focused on translating the theory into everyday applications. 

I have been shadowing Brandon while he does his work at a school in North Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, for the last three years. Mr. Brown works in the PHASES [Philadelphia Healthy and Safe Schools] initiative, is a school-based intervention out of Temple University’s Katz School of Medicine’s Center for Urban Bioethics. The intervention focuses on the debilitating role of trauma in the school which sits in one of the most violent neighborhoods in Philadelphia. The program involves a complex theory of change that begins with creating trust between PHASES staff and the school staff and includes coaching, mentoring, workshops for educators and families, assistance with school and family basic needs, and improvements to the school environment. This is intended to lead to (among other things) increased knowledge and skills among families, faculty, and staff in dealing with their own and students’ trauma; an improved school climate; and, ultimately, increased student learning, improved student mental health, reductions in disciplinary problems, and reduced teacher turnover and absences.  

When working in spaces where trauma is informing people’s behavior – a school in a war zone, a refugee camp on a country’s border, or a non-profit helping to re-locate refugees in a new country -how do you create a trauma-sensitive community and environment?  Brandon Brown posits that most importantly; it is how you act that will set the tone. Next is how you support the staff that is providing the services or interventions that will lead to the creation of a trauma-sensitive community.  Browns answers will help any organization whose mission is to serve traumatized populations as they struggle with high staff turn-overs due to the heavy emotional load for their empathetic staff.  

 

Key Words: Trauma, Regulate, Safety, Self-Care, Listening, Protect 

 

*** 

 

Lori Shorr: Can you give us a definition of what a trauma response is and how do you recognize it? 

Brandon Brown: How do I know that someone might be in distress? 

Shorr: Yes. 

Brown: People that have been trauma-impacted have their own logic, and I won’t understand it because it’s their logic. So, if I had to say, what is a trauma response? A trauma response is their truth that I’m trying to figure out. And I’m not saying that I have to understand it and I’m not trying to fix it, but I just have to just try to figure out what might be some of the causes of this and how when they’re with me, can they become closer to regulation. 

Shorr: Okay. The goal is regulation. And what do you mean by regulation? 

Brown: Well, if I were to be the academic, I would say the ability to access a cortex. But I think if we were to talk about regulating, it’s just the ability to think clearly, to reduce impulsivity and that there’s no threat of harm to self or anyone else.  

Shorr: Okay. I think when I think of trauma response, just as a lay person, I think that probably looks like aggression or something that’s outward facing, but can it look different than that? 

Brown: So, for me, regulation is a constant engagement with self. So, at best, if I had to think of it like a seesaw, it’s the attempt to be in the middle, but recognizing that even when you’re in the middle, you still sway both ways. But it’s trying to be in the middle. It’s trying to stay calm. But I recognize that in most of our spaces, that’s not what we thought. The trauma sensitive language is completely different. There was a question that you didn’t ask, but to be trauma sensitive is almost the opposite of how people were raised and taught. Okay, how so? Well, think about it. Everybody’s suffering about being trauma sensitive or trauma-informed, but you don’t see it in pedagogy of teaching, social work, law enforcement, things of that nature. 

It is a discipline that was created after other disciplines, but we also recognize that when a discipline has been set, they’re not necessarily willing to look at other things. So, trying to use the trauma sensitive approach in coaching. I’ve talked with coaches, I’ve talked with law enforcement, I’ve talked with FBI agents, and they’re going by their training and I’m saying, I get your training, but now we have to figure out something different. Getting teachers to understand that the dysregulated child isn’t being disrespectful, it’s just that they have so much stuff that is going on within them that they don’t necessarily know how to process kids process the way that they can either. They become very quiet, but they can become very explosive. I’ve always said that being trauma sensitive is the antithesis of family tradition, community norms, and academic tutorage. 

Shorr: So, if you were somebody who was running a non-profit in a population of recent refugees from a country at war, what are some things that you would do to try to have that space be informed by a trauma sensitive understanding of what’s going on? Very concretely 

Brown: So, first of all, I would have to check myself. 

Shorr: Okay, and what does that mean? 

Brown: Well, if I come in with the bias, if I come in with bias, my bias is going to infuse. I can’t assume that I know what I’m going to receive. So even we’re talking about here, regardless of what people try to say to me, I want to experience this for myself. 

I don’t care how people might try to share their toxic views or their poisons positions on things. I don’t want anything. Kierkegard said, “Once you label something, you negate it.” So, the thing is, is that if I’m going to work with people, I need to be as open as possible. The other thing is that, and I know this sounds really lofty, but it’s true. I want people to understand that I recognize their humanity. Everybody that would be sitting in that space, whatever they said, that’s their truth. And I have to get people to understand that multiple versions of the truth can coexist in the same space. 

But if we were to be more concrete, it’s really about setting up community norms. And the thing is, what is needed in trauma sensitive spaces, and this is what the research says, you are encouraging safety. I can’t make you feel safe, and I can’t say that this is a safe space. I can’t because it’s only safe once you’ve identified it as a safe space. 

But I need to let you know that everything that I’m doing is to ensure safety. When we do our PDs, the first seven or eight slides are always the same, because I want them to be comfortable with what we’re talking about. I don’t want them to say like, oh, every PDs is different. No, we do our check-ins. There’s a routine expected, and I think that’s what a lot of people have to do. So, whether it’s community norms or check-ins, whatever they choose to do, they have to do it with consistency and they have to embody how they want the other person to be. 

Shorr: Okay. Can you talk about that a little bit? What does that look like? 

Brown: Perfect example. I was talking to some medical students today and they all looked very tired. They had a test a couple of days ago, and this one student, he looked to me, he looked very down. So, I just was talking to him, and I was smiling. Eventually he started smiling, and I said, you have to understand that in this space, I understand that the brains talk to each other. So, if I’m smiling, eventually you will smile. I’m not going to come in and match you. I’m going to try to bring you up so that we can be in that different space. If we wanted to be technical about it, it’s called mirror neurons. For example, if I yawn, you’ll yawn. 

If a baby laughs, more than likely you’re going to smile. That is all. You don’t have to be taught that. That is just something that literally the brains talk to each other. 

Shorr: And I’ve seen you in this building, when people are dysregulated, you are very calm and that your calm wins. 

Brown: Yes, that’s true. But, also, I recognize that sometimes, I am willing to be the deflection. I had an adult in the building literally get mad at a kid and was going after the kid. I got in the middle, I physically got in the middle and I was like, would you like to color? And I’m saying all types of things to draw her anger to me. And she gets mad, and she yells at me. I’m fine with that. I would rather have you yell at me than yell at the kid. And then when we came back to it, she was like, “I know what you did and I appreciate it, but it was just hard to accept at that point in time.”   

Shorr: What else do you think it’s important for people who are running or working in non-profits to know about how to set up a space that can be conducive to people being well-regulated? 

Brown: For people to know? Check for bias. Set up community norms. Be the embodiment of what you want them to be. If I’m in this space working with these people that are going through some things and you want them to listen, I have to listen and I have to protect the group. So, whatever the community norms are, if it’s either step up/step back, or voice equity, these aren’t things that you just check. You’re agreeing that this is how we’re going to operate when we are together, this is how we move when people come into this space.  An example from my work here: not to cuss. I don’t care what you do in the school yard outside, we don’t have loud voices in here. We don’t cuss. One of the kids was in here yesterday and he was trying to be extra, I’ll say. I walked in and I just looked at him. He said, “Sorry Mr. Brandon.” You have to protect the space. And it’s not just the space because kids then know “I have to be like that wherever he is.” There needs to be some level of consistency with it. 

Shorr: Okay, we might have already answered this, but what are three things to do to help create a sense of safety in such a group? I think this is sort of what we’ve been talking about. Are there any other things that you would think of? 

Brown: I would introduce the whole notion of self-care.  

Shorr: What are some things you should not do in such a group? What are some mistakes that people make at these moments? 

Brown: Nonverbal communication. Oftentimes when you’re dealing with people, you have to have a poker face. People are going to say things to you that you don’t agree with, and something can go wrong just because you decided to make a smirk or change your body position. It also tone of voice. I’m very careful. You’ve seen how I move. At no point in time do I ever take a tone of reprimanding – even when I am reprimanding a child or engaging an adult.  I’m not trying to make encounters confrontational. I just want them to hear what I’m saying.  

Shorr: So much of what you’re talking about really has to do with the personal emotional hygiene of the person who is leading the group. 

Brown: If you are not ready, you can’t do it. 

Shorr: What does ready mean?  

Brown: They need to do their own checks: How do you feel about going into this space? What are you thinking about the people that you’re going to engage? What types of things are you doing? We are wired, our brain is wired, to look for threat, and when we don’t see it, we can create it. Then we are on the defensive. So, they can always be a step ahead by just literally checking ourselves. And then you have to be mindful of you what you say to people who are in front of you struggling.  You don’t fix. You don’t solve. You don’t reassure. You don’t story steal. No, let’s just say your dog just died and you would say, “I am sorry that your dog died, but your dog’s in heaven, and that should make you happy.” And I could really just turn around and cuss you out because if I had the ability of having the dog for another day, I would take that. So don’t placate me by saying that, and I think people don’t understand. That’s where the culture comes in. And for the groups, I would say that sometimes people have to learn just to shut their mouth. 

Shorr: You’re not there to provide answers all the time. What is story stealing? 

Brown: If you’re telling me something and I say, “Oh, that reminds me of a time…” and, then all of a sudden, I make it about me. Other things: you don’t ask questions or make comments while other people are talking. If you would’ve waited, more than likely the information would’ve gotten out. I’m very careful not to make comments or ask questions when people are telling me their stories because I recognize it’s a power moment for them. 

Shorr: I know I’ve witnessed you when you’re interacting with people that the pace is slow. It’s purposefully slow. You’re not trying to get someplace with it. You are standing there being calm, creating space for other people to experience whatever it is they’re experiencing. 

Brown: Because I want them to know that I’m recognizing their humanity. I’m not going to come in and say, you shouldn’t be feeling the way that you’re feeling. Again, when someone has gone through something the way that they see it or remember it, sometimes it only makes sense to them. If we were to have this bigger conversation about trauma and the brain we could go deeper. If I were to ask you, “Tell me about last Thanksgiving dinner.” You would have a full memory probably from beginning to end of how things happened in sequence. But if it was a traumatic memory, the trauma actually changes the sequence.  

Shorr: Because the brain at the time that the traumatic event is happening doesn’t record in the same way. 

Brown: And you could have been there with them when it happened, but that is their memory. So, check your bias. Try to use active listening statements. Slow things down. Just learn how to be quiet. Not everything has to have a response. And also debrief with somebody when you’re done. So I say: Check yourself in the beginning and debrief with yourself and someone else if you can, at the end because you’re absorbing all of that energy.  

Shorr: What does that look like? 

Brown: Literally, you have to talk to somebody. What I tell the teachers here is that literally you should have a debrief buddy. Somebody that you talk about your entire day or what bothered you during the day before you leave. Okay, get it out. Get it out. If you think about it this way, and I know I’m talking a lot, but your people in this non-profit are absorbing a lot of energy in the their work with traumatized people, so you’re exposing them to vicarious and secondary trauma. And if that’s not addressed, then you’re going to have burnout. So, your people might say that they’re going to commit for a year. You might find out that they can only do three months. But why is it that they can only do three months? Because they’re holding on to all of this secondary and vicarious trauma. 

Shorr: So vicarious and secondary trauma, can you talk about that for a second?  

Brown: I was trying not to be academic. So, with vicarious trauma, I hear the story and the story has impacted me. Think about any news story that you’ve watched and you’re like it really touched you and it stayed with you. That’s vicarious trauma. You weren’t there, right? With secondary trauma, it’s almost vicarious, but with secondary it’s like I didn’t know the person. So, George Floyd, Tamir Rice, we didn’t know them. We couldn’t experience anything through them, but we were moved by their murders. That’s secondary.  

Shorr: So, if you’re somebody who is absorbing a lot of this, it’s something that happens in your job, what are some other ways that folks like yourself can make sure that they’re taking care of themselves so that they’re in it for the long haul? 

Brown: I’m more holistic, but it sounds very hokey. It’s just to develop a safety plan. 

Shorr: So, what’s a safety plan? 

Brown: Safety plan is made up of things that you can do for yourself during the course of the day that will give yourself grace, merit, and credit. So, a safety plan are things that I can do to myself to put money in my checking account, like my figurative relationship checking account. So, I do these little things for myself so that I know that I’m ready to sit with my staff members or so I’m ready to deal with three kids who are having strong reactions at the same time. It’s more of a lifestyle. 

Shorr: So, tell me what are some things that are on people’s safety plans? On yours? 

Brown: On mine? I listen to music. I listen to music all the time. I like to walk. I play Pokemon Go. I understand my body, that my body was raised to be in motion. And when I don’t have a lot of motion that my body just starts to have a problem. But oftentimes people’s safety plan could be reconnecting with things that they used to love, but because they got older, they just didn’t do anymore. What’s wrong with playing with Legos? What’s wrong with reading a picture book? What’s wrong with coloring? And it doesn’t have to be an adult coloring book, but just what were the things that bring you joy? And I think oftentimes people like to go Bible. When I was a child, I acted as a child, but when I became an adult, I put away my childish things. But in truth, that’s not true because for most people, that’s when they have their joy and we sort of believe that adults have to be joyless. Find your joy. If you find your joy, then you find your work. And for the people that this article is directly speaking to, they might be the change. Because if everybody else has been sort of consumed with toxicity and dysregulation, I need to be able to see somebody or experience somebody who is centered and joyful. I can’t smile if nobody’s smiling. 

Shorr: Yeah, yeah. So, you have to embody it in some senses. 

Brown: Yeah. I would be coming into these groups, not trying to belittle everything, but I would want people to see that I am happy to be here. And oftentimes I think the mistake people make is they mirror whatever emotion is there. No, no, no, no, no. I rebuke that. That’s got nothing to do with me. I want you on this side, so whatever I can do to slow it down. Oftentimes when we’re dysregulated, things go real quick. So, I talk slow, I take my time, I’m time aware, but I’m not time rigid. If the PHASES folks had stayed here for five minutes for the meeting, I’d have been fine. I appreciate them for coming here because I recognize that for some, this is just their space, and if I get five minutes out of it, then that’s it. I’m fine. Sometimes the groups might not be anything. Sometimes the groups just might be like, can we just sit here for a minute? 

They are saying in their heads: “I’ve gone through a lot and I just to be still like, can we just be still with it?”  Some the groups might be like, you know what? Anybody want color? Does it always have to be a conversation? Or can it just be an activity and just say, thank you for being here? I think we get into this whole notion of what it means to help, but I think that oftentimes we fail to realize that the way that we want to help someone is really hurting them. Do I just want to bring people together so they can talk about their ills. Do you want to talk about your ills all the time? 

Shorr: No. 

Brown: So why do we want to pretend or project that other people want to do that all the time? 

Shorr: But that’s the representation, at least in western cultures that we see. You sit in a group, people take turns talking about their ills, the horrors, what has been done to them. And people silently listen to that. 

Brown: Help me understand something. Let’s say you have five people in a group, and they are refugees from internal strife. How is me sharing my “heavy” to four other people going to make their “heavy” lighter? 

Shorr: Because they don’t feel alone in it? 

Brown: But I’ve still given you my “heavy”, so you become heavier. I think the whole thing for me is do we need to share, or do we just need to do some general processing? 

Shorr: What’s the difference? 

Brown: Do I want to know your story, or do we want to talk about what you would like to become? The sharing of the story is heavy. It’s heavy. I don’t think anybody’s going to walk out of there. I’ve never been to an AA meeting, or I’ve never been to an NA meeting. I’m always curious about the length of time it takes to get through that. And I’m always wondering if the reason why it takes so much time is because not only am I processing my heavy, but I’m hearing everybody else’s heavy every week. 

Shorr: So, when you think about creating a group or a space for people who have had traumatic experiences, you’re not envisioning the thing that I just described, which is everybody goes around and talks about their heavy.  

Brown: So, it would be acknowledging that something has happened to you at some point in time, if you should feel comfortable talking about it, we will figure out how to talk about it. We are going to make the group norm if we’re going to talk about it as a group, or do you just want to talk to me? One on one? Right? Yeah. I also might discourage you from sharing the heavy with everyone prematurely, because some people might want to come in the group the first day and talk about all of this stuff. Yeah, that’s unfair. I stay away from therapy. The whole notion of it being viewed as therapy, because in therapy you talk, but in this place, I’m asking for voice equity. 

Shorr: Can you define voice equity? 

Brown: Voice equity. So, I want everybody to be able to talk, but I’m not asking everybody. In some of the classes that I teach, sometimes people want to come in and use it as therapy and I cut ’em off. I’m not going to allow it. I understand your need to share, but I have to protect the group. If anything, if one of the things that comes out of this conversation is: You have to protect the group. 

Shorr: So, what are you protecting the group from? 

Brown: Themselves, from behaviors that haven’t been checked by family, community, or culture. So, if I’m dealing with someone, if she wants to sit there and be quiet, she can, because I recognize that more than likely she doesn’t want to talk to me, but she’s comfortable in the space. The space is what’s important. Some people are very more boisterous. For me, it’s that whole notion of step up, step back. If you talk too much, tone it down. And if you don’t talk a lot, just step it up. 

Shorr: Are there any on-line resources you would recommend that people could access for more information on these subjects? 

Brown: Anything by Bruce Perry. Just Google anything Bruce Perry. So, you have brain states, you have something called the three Rsi. And the three Rs is actually a beautiful way of thinking about how to engage your group. Because oftentimes when we do things, we think about Reason, Relate, and then Regulate. When in truth, it’s the other way around. The first thing that you always want to do in a group is you want to regulate yourself and which helps them to regulate. Hence, that’s why when you see me, the first thing that I always want to do with people is regulate. After we regulate, then I might Relate. I want to hear if I have the opportunity to share some information. And then we go into the Reason. 

Shorr: Because you can’t reason until you regulate. Whereas sometimes people try to reason people into regulating.  So, what are some of the lessons you’ve learned doing the work you do in schools with children who’ve experienced trauma in their lives?  

Brown: I think the number one thing is that in this space, you don’t take anything personal. So, the minute I begin to think it’s you, the minute I start to take it personal, is when it is going to become problematic. I have kids that are mad all day, and sometimes because I am there, they wish to be mad at me, but it’s not personal. 

I have teachers that are comfortable complaining to me. I don’t absorb that energy. I make sure that I get rid of it. I talk to people, or I go for a walk, my goal is 16,000 steps a day. That is part of my self-care. That’s why usually when you see me in the building, I’m constantly walking because I’m walking from one hotspot to another. Oftentimes I don’t even get a chance to debrief. But the walking helps. I would say just practice some of the basics, like learning how to use active listening statements. 

Shorr: So, can you give us examples of active listening statements? 

Brown: Sure. It sounds like you want to talk about what active listening statements are. If I heard you correctly, you would like some more information about active listening statements. Those are all active listening statements. And I can send you, there’s a website that I useii. It has all of the active listening statements, and I always tell people this, look at it. And you automatically draw a line through the ones that say, that doesn’t sound like me. So, in truth, you might only have four or five sentence starters. And it’s not to say that every sentence starts with the active listening statement, right? But you just figure out how to affirm. That’s all that active listening is. It’s affirming what you heard, affirming them by giving them back what you heard. And the best part about active listening, because one of the things I forgot to say that’s very important is that in the group, it’s about safety and it’s about relationships. Because when you have the relationship with someone. If I do an active listening statement, but it’s not correct, you will correct me, but you won’t get mad at me saying like, “Oh, he’s not listening or this other stuff.” You’ll be like, “No, no, that’s not what I said.” And I’m like, “Oh, can you say it again? So, I can, in my mind, I’m going to try it again. It’s a good indicator of a strong relationship. Also, most of us have never really experienced regulation. So, it might be a new thing. I come from a hothead family. I do, 

Shorr: They must not know what to do with you now that you are so centered and calm. 

Brown: But you have to think of holistic things, and it’s even like remembering to breathe deeply. Sometimes when I’m talking with the teachers and I’m talking with the kids, I’m just trying to remind myself to take a deep breath. 

I mean, that’s something we haven’t talked about yet, but it is a really big part of what you do with the teachers and the students, or staff members and group participants, is to remind them to breathe deeply. Because that regulates in some sense. Big belly. It’s got to be big belly breaths. It’s not a chest breath, it’s a belly breath. It’s got to take a big belly breath. 

Shorr: And what does that do when you take a big, deep 

Brown: But we have something in the body called the vhgus nerve system. Its sole responsibility is to regulate the body. You can access it through your head, your heart, and your stomach. And the easiest way to do it’s through your stomach. So, if I were working, say I was sitting in the room working with the people that were about to go out, I would be sitting there talking with them about trying to figure out how to keep them calm in the midst of that storm. 

Shorr: And one of the things they would do is to say take deep belly breaths. You’re saying the best way to get through it is through the stomach. 

Brown: The thing is, we’re not really taught to take deep breaths. No. Oftentimes when people start to do it, they feel lightheaded. And that’s because you’re actually oxygenating the blood. Not to get too techy about it, but that’s really what’s happening. The chest breath isn’t what sustains you, it’s the belly. 

Shorr: So, part of your self-care could be just remembering to take those big, deep belly breaths that help you to regulate. 

Brown: We want to figure out ways that we can release the good stuff, the endorphins, and don’t release the cortisol. The cortisol is the stress rate. We don’t want to do things that will release that. We want things that will release the endorphins. 

Shorr: Belly breaths, do that. What else does that? 

Brown: Belly breath, a piece of chocolate, listening to music, having a picture on your phone, having a picture on your computer, wearing a particular perfume or cologne. Anything that you associate with peace and calm. 

Shorr: I’ve noticed that teachers here ask students to take drinks of water. Is that something that makes you calmer? 

Brown: Taking sips of water is similar to deep breathing. But I also understand that if you’re dysregulated and I give you water and say, take 10 sips, more than likely you’re going to drink the water. Deregulation makes you thirsty. So, I might give you a bottle of water and say, “Here, take a sip right here. Take a sip. You might drink the whole thing down. That’s fine. That’s what you needed. But I still need you to take the 10 sips.” 

Shorr: And taking 10 sips does…

Brown: It’s the regulation. When you take a sip, that’s air that goes straight to the belly. That was one of the first things that I brought to the school, and they were like, “We don’t get it.” We don’t have to. I would walk kids to the water fountain and say, “I need you to take 10 sips.” And they’re go, go, go, go, go, go, go. “That’s fine. But you didn’t take my 10 sips. 10 sips and fine.” That’s why I keep water here.  

Shorr: A lot of what I hear you saying is there’s physical things that you can do to help you regulate yourself. And that that’s a key part of being in a space with a lot of people who have experiences trauma and are dysregulated. You have to be calm yourself through safety plan and self-care. You can help them regulate through doing very concrete things like take big “belly” breaths or sips of water? Anything else? 

Brown: Literally, it’s like drinking water, getting sleep, taking breaths, debriefing afterwards with yourself or somebody else. At the end of the day, these are just things that I would probably say work for the majority of people. But the thing is that that’s not what we’re taught. 

Shorr: A fidget is another thing which you encourage people to use. The school has them all over the place for adult and student use. For people who don’t know what fidgets are, can you explain? 

Brown: They are small. It can be anything. It could be anything you can have in your hand. I had a mechanical pencil, an eraser fell out into my pocket, and I used that for about three weeks. It was something about me just rolling it that I really liked. It can be a paper clip. It doesn’t have to be anything huge. Each fidget has its own neurological response, right?  

Shorr: I like this one. (Picks up an object.) 

Brown: How did you know that though? 

Shorr: Made me happy when I picked it up. 

Brown: Do you see what I’m saying? The thing is you would never know unless you go through the gamut. What I tell people is you have to find your own fidget.